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Talk:Banquet of the Golden Witch/Truth
Concerning the solution given for the first twilight... "locked the chapel from the inside" I’m not sure whether this is the manga solution or not but it contradicts the red truth. In regards to the first twilight of EP3, we have the following: No device exists which can lock them without a key, such as an auto-lock. ' '''There is no means of locking the doors and windows of those six rooms without the keys. ' Of course this red conflicts with the premise established in EP2 that the locks on normal rooms in the mansion are constructed to allow one to lock the rooms from the inside without a key. It is possible that Beato is using a definition of the action of locking that only includes locking from the outside, however this is not well supported because she specifically says things like "'''No trick could have the effect of locking the door from the outside without using a key." in other situations. We can also resolve this as Beato changing the premise, similar to how she altered the number of master keys from EP1 to EP2, though one would think that attention would be drawn to this if that was the case. To be honest I find myself thinking that this is just an honest mistake on Ryuukishi's part, and that the red regarding this chain of rooms should include that "from the outside" clause. I'm actually hoping I'll spot some explicit reference of one of these rooms being lockable from the inside on my next reread, that way I can put this to bed as a cut and dry mistake. Nevertheless, even if you follow the existing red to the letter it does not actually constitute a logic error, although the fix is significantly more involved than "It is however never said in red that the last three rooms, including the chapel, were locked." That assertion is technically correct but was obviously made without realizing that the following is stated in red regarding the first twilight of EP3: 'All five master keys were discovered, each in the pocket of one of the servants! The individual keys were found inside envelopes alongside the corpses! In short, all keys related to the linked closed rooms were locked inside the linked closed rooms!! ' This means that every room in which a key was found was indeed locked. It also confirms that the keys were legitimately discovered inside the rooms and not just faux-discovered by an accomplice who was already in possession of them. The way out is that it does not actually confirm that the specific keys were discovered in the specific rooms purported by Virgilia's reconstruction. So we could have a situation where, for instance, the parlor key and Kanon's master key were actually discovered in one of the other five rooms, not the chapel. In that case the red requiring each room in which a key was discovered to be locked does not actually guarantee that the chapel was locked. So what we're left with is something like this. Two master keys were in Sayo's pocket when Shannon was discovered in the parlor. There were also two envelopes, one containing the key to the next room in the chain and one containing the parlor key. Nanjo pocketed one of the master keys and the parlor key envelope (since the envelopes are presumably identical he must have been told ahead of time which one contained the parlor key). Later, when entering the chapel, Nanjo must have been the one who opened the unlocked door, and pretended to unlock it with the chapel key discovered in the boiler room. Then when examining Kanon, he pretended to find the master key and envelope that he pocketed before. Of course this trick is hard to swallow because it requires the human culprit to foresee the red text requiring any room in which a key is found to be locked (which Beato didn't even state until the showdown at the end of EP4), and take these actions solely to avoid conflicting with it. While we later see this kind of meta-aware motivation from Erika, that's on the part of a player that is intentionally trying to give the game and everything it stands for the middle finger. One would think Beato would take more care to conserve the internal consistency of her game board. On the other hand, you could also view the assertion given in EP6 that Beato came close to logic errors in her games as a nod to this whole thing. It could be a legitimate mistake she made and had to cover up with a messy ret-con such as the above. Though given how Will answered, I’m convinced that at the time of writing EP7 Ryuukishi was not aware of this issue (and if locking the door from the inside is indeed the manga solution I’d say he didn’t realize it in time for that either). Whatever the case, it's a real shame that this screwed up what was supposed to be the closed room that struck at the heart of the whole Shannon and Kanon trick, since if the chapel isn't actually locked you don't need that kind of trick at all. Just thought I’d share my stream of consciousness about this. Who knows, someone may actually read this. 12:24, February 4, 2019 (UTC)